Does Eckhart Tolle eat meat?

Eckhart Tolle
Eckhart Tolle

Yes he does, according to his partner Kim Eng.

It’s such a curious question isn’t it: “Are spiritual people, truly enlightened people, vegetarians?” And the answer is clearly “not necessarily.”

If you look at the great spiritual masters, there’s no common theme with regards to meat eating. Buddha wasn’t rigid about it and said it was okay if you were offered it, the Dalai Lama follows this path and is vegetarian at home but will eat meat if away.

Jesus fed the 5000 fish and loaves which he magically produced. Jesus said “What goes into someone’s mouth does not defile them, but what comes out of their mouth, that is what defiles them.” Matthew 15:11. And “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; or about your body, what you will wear.” Luke 12:22

And enlightened master Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj, of “I AM THAT” fame, had no issue with meat eating or even smoking. Here’s an excerpt from I AM THAT…

Q: My body influences me deeply. In more than one way my body is my destiny. My character, my moods, the nature of my reactions, my desires and fears — inborn or acquired — they are all based on the body. A little alcohol, some drug or other and all changes. Until the drug wears off I become another man.

M: All this happens because you think yourself to be the body. realise your real self and even drugs will have no power over you.

Q: You smoke?

M: My body kept a few habits which may as well continue till it dies. There is no harm in them.

Q: You eat meat?

M: I was born among meat-eating people and my children are eating meat. I eat very little — and make no fuss.

Q: Meat-eating implies killing.

M: Obviously. I make no claims of consistency. You think absolute consistency is possible; prove it by example. Don’t preach what you do not practise.

Similarly, here’s what Ramana Maharshi had to say on the subject:

M: Habit is only adjustment to the environment. It is the mind that matters. The fact is that the mind has been trained to think certain foods tasty and good. The food material is to be had both in vegetarian and non-vegetarian diet equally well. But the mind desires such food as it is accustomed to and considers tasty.

D: Are there restrictions for the realised man in a similar manner?

M: No. He is steady and not influenced by the food he takes.

Eckhart Tolle sees life as one dynamic whole; an inter-connectedness, an inter-action, oneness. Life eats life, everywhere…

I saw on TV the other day, whales hunting. They pincered a shoal of fish and then came from underneath to catch thousands in one mouthful. Does that make a whale evil?

Is a whale or a dolphin evil for eating fish?

Having had my head into nutrition for over 20 years, I’m uncomfortable from a health point of view with pure vegetarianism (and the dairy industry is crueler than the meat industry so I’m told by vegans).

Interestingly, I’ve seen Eckhart Tolle dodge this question many times in seminars and TV interviews. He just advises to…

“Be present with whatever your food choices are and then the right food choice will happen for you… it needs to come from within rather than as something from without.”

This view is perfectly echoed by non-physical beings Abraham, channeled by Esther Hicks…

“Imagine if you could let being aligned be your first priority — a lot of vegans would be inspired to a lot of eating that their veganism would not allow, but the source within them would call them toward.” — Abraham-Hicks

And here is another wonderful and enlightening explanation from Abraham about using/killing animals for food. The clearest explanation I’ve come across

Yet another echo of the same perspective from Adyashanti:

Safransky: Could killing animals to eat them come from wholeness?

Adyashanti: Sure. Life is killing. If we eat a vegetable, we’ve killed it. If we eat an animal, we’ve killed it. To be a living organism is to kill. There is no life without death. When we die, we’re going to be nutrients for something else.

I don’t see life as “anything goes,” but I have seen wholeness move through different people in different ways. That’s why I’m always talking about action that comes from wholeness, not from division, nor rejection, nor grasping, nor pushing away. What motivates us when we’re not pushing or grasping, not relying on conditioned concepts of right and wrong, good and bad? Is there something else that can move us? And what is that? Action that is an expression of a clear and undivided state of consciousness is what the Buddha meant by “right action.” To exercise right action we must be functioning from a place outside of all egoic self-interest. We must be awake within the dream and be able to express that perspective.

The take-home message from these spiritual masters is clear: Be whole, then see what you do.

Cat and mouse

People’s pre-judgement on the basis of this issue would be detrimental to their own enlightenment. Because if you saw as Eckhart does, life as oneness, then you would probably also not be overly concerned about any particular FORM, as all the forms are continuously morphing and changing. In fact, there is only life and it is ONE life, there is no death anywhere to be seen! And… life eats life, everywhere. My cat isn’t evil for eating mice.

What do you think? Do you think vegetarians are more spiritual? Please let us know by leaving a comment below.

Best wishes,
Michael Kinnaird

Free chapter

Michael Kinnaird is the author of Happy Guide, the result of a 20 year exploration into what works for health and happiness.

It only takes an hour to read and it’ll show you both what to change and how to change.

Read Chapter 1 “The Happiness Secret”
Or get the paperback…

Get a free happiness tip from Happy Guide every day. Great for staying on track to a happier, healthier life...

166 thoughts on “Does Eckhart Tolle eat meat?

  1. To put the question, “Do you think vegetarians are more spiritual?” in perspective, we only have to recall that Adolf Hitler was a vegetarian. He was the sort of person who became a vegetarian, not because he loved animals, but because he hated plants. The thought of cutting up vegetables and devouring them, particularly while they were fresh and presumably still alive, gave him a fiendish satisfaction.

    1. “Sri Nisargadatta’s” comments and other similar perspectives are, frankly, ridiculous. Did he eat? Did he sleep? Did he evacuate when he felt the urge or would he have been OK suppressing it for eternity? Our body influences our consciousness because we all are on the bodily platform, thinking we are this body. What we eat, drink or smoke changes our mental demeanor and our overall consciousness, slowly but surely. What to speak of the karma from giving credence to/sanctioning the merciless slaughterhouse culture– from what point of view is that compassionate, compassion being a prerequisite for true spiritual engagement. While it is true that we are not the changing body, mind or even material intelligence, we cannot artificially transcend the bodily platform to self realization. We have to engage our mind, body and senses spiritually rather than ignore them and thus slowly spiritualize them. The soul is by nature active and it needs spiritual/positive activity. The bona fide Vedic (literally “of knowledge”) process was systematized in the Bhagavad Gita As It Is by AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, as part of the bhakti yoga philosophy as applied to our modern psychophysical natures and conditioning.

      1. Point being: If they have truly realized their identity as spirit soul and not the body, why do they take care of the body? And if they are truly self-controlled, why do they have to succumb to meat and intoxicants? That means lack of control, else why go out of one’s way to invest in cigarettes? There are lots of bogus gurus in the world today, and that is where our intelligence (discrimination) comes in to separate the bona fide from the quacks/mixtures.

      2. My discrimination tells me that Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj is the real deal, it tells me that Eckhart and Abraham are also the real deal. Have you read I AM THAT? I feel it is impossible to read that and feel unsure. Where are we “coming from” when we make our choices? From an idea of self? From an idea of compassion? From an idea of what a spiritual person does? Or from Being? Being is a state of wholeness, aligned with the whole of life… is that not the true state in which to choose?

        Is the lion confused, lacking compassion? The whale? The dolphin? What about compassion for your own body, which will suffer greatly on a vegan diet?

        It is clear that life is eating life everywhere without thinking about it, transforming lower forms into higher ones.

        Plants eat dead animals. It’s one whole dynamic of immense complexity.

        I agree that we come to spirit through the body/mind, and I hear many stories of how no progress could be made on vegan diet. The brain needs nutrition that is sub-optimal on a vegan diet. You wouldn’t even have the intelligence to ponder the question if your ancestors hadn’t eaten animal foods for the last 2 and a half million years.

      3. An animal’s priorities are eating, sleeping, mating, defending. We pursue music, art, science, ethics, philosophy. Animals have limited free will– they are much more bound by bodily urges than we are (clearly). Humans can control or ponder over them. Human life is mean for introspection and self control, and asking “who am I?” Why pick and choose what an animal does and adapt it to our lives selectively? My other simple, clear (rhetorical) questions remain unanswered. By the way, for every “study” you quote one can pull out hundreds saying the opposite thing. People in India, for example, have been vegetarian for centuries and have one of the lowest rates of cardiac failure and diet-based diseases (those who can afford a square meal, that is)! If one turns vegetarian and eats only corn and potatoes, well clearly there’s a problem there. What you call “Being” refers to the undivided spiritual substance called “Brahman” in yoga texts. If one is truly acting from “Being” then one feels compassion for all living entities, since we are part and parcel of the same Grand Whole, bhagavan. For example, you could step on an ant, but to kill a pig, chicken, dog or a cow would make our insides revolt, as Mr. Tolle himself puts it. Therefore, hiding behind a veil of convenience while slaugtherhouses go on with their business willy-nilly is not the best option. For example, try you-tubing a typical slaughterhouse video and research how typical it is. This post is for the benefit of the readers and not an egoic riposte, thank you for posting.

      4. I wonder about the idea of revulsion at killing for food. My wife is vegetarian and always calls meat, “death.” But recently some cows attacked her and there have been a lot of cases of death by cow. Now she buys beef at every opportunity. A sudden shift in perspective.

        In Texas I think it is, they have a problem with feral pigs… domesticated breeds that have escaped into the wild. They are breeding out-of-control and raid farms, destroying the crops and the livelihoods of the farmers. Now we have a different perspective, when our own lives are threatened.

        If I airlifted you into a remote tribe in South America, a tribe of hunter-gatherers, and you had to survive in nature, I think your perspective about animals would rapidly shift.

        Recently, wolves were reintroduced into a national park in America to keep the ecosystem balance healthy, and the herds of herbivores healthy, they were failing until the wolves were reintroduced.

        We need a much wider understanding a perspective of NATURE to understand our role IN IT. At the moment, we are disconnected, seeing ourselves apart, taking and taking mainly without maintaining balance.

        The discussion about meat eating is always shoehorned into ideas of factory farming and cruelty. But these are separate issues. Solutions that allow us to eat our natural diet, while greatly benefiting and creating natural ecosystems exist, right now, but they are not widespread.

        I hear a much different story about the health of people in India. A very quick web search reveals “The Indian subcontinent (including India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, and Nepal) has among the highest rates of cardiovascular disease (CVD) globally.

        “…to kill a pig, chicken, dog or a cow would make our insides revolt, as Mr. Tolle himself puts it.” He has not said this to my knowledge, please provide your source.

      5. I was only referring to Mr. Tolle’s idea of our insides curling up when faced with something unnatural– I did not mean to imply that he espoused vegetarianism, which he clearly doesn’t as you mention in your article.

        Again, I was referring to those able to afford a balanced vegetarian meal. How can one tell? Perhaps this is a better reference from a presentation point of view, from the American Heart Association: “Many studies have shown that vegetarians seem to have a lower risk of obesity, coronary heart disease (which causes heart attack), high blood pressure, diabetes mellitus and some forms of cancer. ” Or see, http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/255644.php. Red meat, especially, is dangerous.

        One can infer a lot that is seemingly between the lines. I am in no way implying that if one’s only source of food is animals on a deserted island, then things don’t change. I am only advocating “no UNNECESSARY suffering,” which is clear as day causing havoc in animal society. Are we a part of the problem or the solution, that is the question, and to what extent. I agree we ARE extremely conditioned– the question is what raises our individual and collective spiritual consciousness, and what undermines it, and the answer can certainly depend on our time, place and circumstance to some degree. If one kills in self-defence, that is different from cold-blooded murder, just to give a general analogy. In material consciousness, we are full of different perspectives: one man’s food is another’s poision, but what is spiritually beneficial for us is a tangible experiential question with a clear answer.

      6. “Many studies have shown that vegetarians seem to have a lower risk of obesity, coronary heart disease (which causes heart attack), high blood pressure, diabetes mellitus and some forms of cancer.”

        A lower risk compared to what? The standard American diet? Once wonders why the traditional Inuit diet of primarily animals kept them disease free then, and why all hunter-gatherers show the same disease resistance. If you want to know what an animal’s natural diet is, observe them in the wild. Think about NATURE as a guide, and it will clear a lot of stuff up for you.

      7. Hare Krishna Kunal,
        Very well-articulated :). I will try to help making this life saving point:
        I decided to become a vegetarian a few years ago after somebody told me that by eating meat you get really bad karma and have to reincarnate again. After reincarnation you could easily be killed by the animals you killed in this life. I also used to smoke cigarettes. I stopped smoking cigarettes. And I can say out of my own experience that the best thing in life I ever did was to stop eating meat. I haven’t been sick ever since. Stop smoking was a few years after this. And after a week I immediately experienced eternal bliss. Also I recommend reading the books of H.G. A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami as this will help you to get a better understanding about this topic.

        Ys. Tristan

      8. It is an absurd notion to imagine one can consume the suffering inflicted on animals and profess to be in any way a truly compassionate human being. The two are utterly incompatible. If we are no different than predatory animals than why bother with enlightenment at all? And if animals eat each other why not indulge in cannabalism? It is true not all vegans are necessarily spirituality enlightened but it is certainly a fact that people who continue to defend and continue to be carnivores will always fall short on their spiritual path

    2. This is not true – Hitlers favourite dish was Turkey casserole. The reason why they tried to portray him as vegetarian was because they wanted more people to like so they looked at what Ghandi was doing – vegetarian – and pushed that for Hitler but it is propaganda. If you read his biographies you would see he wasn’t a vegetarian at all 😊

      1. It’s the “if we can live a healthy life” part I have a problem with…

        https://happy.guide/2014/03/16/vegan-diet/

        Also, veganism does not mean no harm. Imagine 10,000 acres of rainforest cleared to grow soy, or wheat, or palm. What about the harm to yourself from an inadequate diet? I have read countless accounts of pain and suffering through a vegan diet.

        Even the Dalai Lama is not vegetarian!

        If we could be healthy then I would do it. Unfortunately all the evidence says no, we can’t.

        I take issue with causing SUFFERING, and there are a lot of problems with our food supply which could be made wonderful by incorporating permaculture principles… sustainable eco systems.

      2. The rain forest is being cleared to grow gains like soy to feed ANIMALS, the demand for animal products is the main cause of the destruction of the rain forest. About half of the worlds grain is fed to animals. The average American diet takes 18x more land and 13x more water to produce than a vegan diet. Animal agriculture is the leading cause of desertification, ocean dead zones, water pollution, and habitat loss. Watch COWSPIRACY. This video is a short summary phone dot environmental impact of animal agriculture. Vegans have the lowest rate of cancer. It’s not the vegans coming down with chronic diseases.

      3. The rain forest is being cleared to grow gains like soy to feed ANIMALS

        That as well sure. The point is that a vegan diet is not harmless. Land is cleared to grow crops, pesticides kill wildlife, even organic ones. In my view, it would be a good idea to use the natural eco-system, e.g. prairie, forest etc., to determine the type of food obtained, and these eco-systems could be largely self-maintaining and regulating. There are parts of the world where only grazing animals can provide livelihood, they are rough, rocky, bleak landscapes, but sheep and goats can thrive there. I’m not in favor of clearing natural forest, but people need an income, which I have heard could actually come from the forest. There are ways.

        About half of the worlds grain is fed to animals.

        Not in favor of that. Joel Salatin seems to me to be a man with a clue. He has videos on YouTube if you’re interested. Cows should eat grass etc.

        The average American diet takes 18x more land and 13x more water to produce than a vegan diet.

        The industrial system of food is a mess on so many levels, you can’t compare that to how it could be.

        Vegans have the lowest rate of cancer. It’s not the vegans coming down with chronic diseases.

        Nutrition and lifestyle have hundreds of interacting factors, so epidemiology is well known to produce gross errors, you know, like driving a BMW is correlated to heart-disease, so if you want to prevent a heart attack, best stop driving a BMW. Vegans are MUCH more likely to be health conscious and so do other health-promoting things, and although an attempt is often made to correct for these, the whole thing is fraught with problems. In addition, even given the health conscious nature of vegans, they do not do well in all-cause mortality meta-analysis. It is never enough to say one thing is correlated with an outcome, you then have to find the cause, which given the massive number of interacting factors, is difficult. The elephant in the room is that hunter-gatherers, even the biggest flesh eater of all, the Inuit, do not suffer diseases of civilization, heart-disease, cancer, diabetes, etc. In my current opinion, vegan propaganda really is a house of cards, sounds so compelling and rational, but it really collapses on deeper investigation. If you only listen to one side of a debate, then it’s easy to buy into “the case for veganism.” Most don’t have the time or inclination to dig that deep, it’s a full time job!

    3. Actually, it’s not true that Adolf Hitler was a vegetarian. Do a little deeper research. I find this whole article just pure justification. I’d like to see Tolle, Nisargadatta and any other “enlightened” being take a tour through a slaughterhouse. I’d like to see them watch as a baby cow was taken away from its mother, crated up alone, and later slaughtered for veal. I’d like to see what they had to say about sows cramped up in sow crates that were so small they can’t even turn around in. How about baby chicks being put through shredders? The factory farms of today are torture chambers for animals. Any truly spiritual person, with heart chakra awakened as it should be, would never support these atrocities.

      1. Factory farming is a different issue. I think there are very few people who would disagree with you about animal cruelty. What DRIVES it? People choosing the lowest price in the supermarket is what drives all sorts of insanity and cruelty. It does not need to be that way. For example, Joel Salatin has some sane ideas, he had lots of videos on YouTube and is a farmer (Polyface farm). He has a website too. This is a huge subject — how we get our food, and there is so much wrong with the system as it is, as I said DRIVEN by lowest price wins. Ultimately, if you track it to the roots, it is our economic system at the very roots… every man for himself, competition not cooperation, greed and sociopathic traits rewarded, no true social security.

      1. Jesus did not live in todays world of factory farming and I am sure he would have condemned it if he did. When you eat meat you contribute to extreme animal suffering. There is a wide range of vegan foods. I am sorry, but even from a Christian point of view the ideal diet was vegan – meat was only allowed after the fall. Doesn’t this tell you something. If it doesn’t google ‘Christian vegans’ and look at the reasons they give for there food choice.

    1. Meister Eckhart is wrong. It also matters who the sentient beings you eat are. Animals are not ‘objects’ or ‘food’ they have their own life force that you deprive them of when you eat them. You are exerting power over them. See the life of Sri Ramana, Gandi and many others. Alice Walker said ‘animals exist for their own reasons, they were not made for us anymore than blacks were made for white or women for men.’

    2. …And who we are is what we do…You might be familiar with the caption, “You are what you eat.” …If you haven’t already watched the documentary “Earthlings” right to the end, please educate yourself – no one could question a vegan’s motives after this gut-wrenching footage exposing the 21st century’s holocaust of violence towards animals. The natural world operates on a vastly different basis re meat consumption. Humans aren’t carnivores – we don’t need meat (or dairy) for our survival, let alone for our health! How much more empirical evidence does the world require to understand the correlation between meat and dairy products and cancer, stroke, heart-attacks, etc? Human animals constructed 60cm – 2 meter sow stalls – not non-human animals, and for what purpose do these mass-scale factory farms exist? Yep, profit does make the world go round, and human greed and selfishness will ultimately stop it from going around. Can our enjoyment of animal flesh possibly justify the horrors inflicted on other sentient animals? Therein lies the spiritual choice vegans make to abstain from cruelty, in the name of compassion. The health benefits of a vegan diet surely go without saying.

      1. Earthlings leaves one with a distorted picture. Yes, these things clearly happen but if you take only cruelty and show 90 minutes of it, who could fail not to be disgusted and sickened? I think almost everyone would agree that cruelty and CAFOs should stop. The issue is health and nature. Veganism came last in an study of mortality against vegetarian and meat-eaters. And that is something when you consider that vegans are likely to be more health conscious in terms of alcohol, smoking, exercise etc.

        All the evidence for veganism I have seen does NOT prove causation of meat/dairy > disease. Please show me evidence of causation. Correlation is NOT evidence, because the number of interacting factors is immense. For example, the net acid/alkali effect of the diet is one factor. A net alkaline diet is known to be good for health. Now if in China you correlate meat (acid-forming) against disease rates it may show a correlation. That proves nothing in a grain based (acid) diet. One would EXPECT it. That proves absolutely nothing.

        I would LOVE to be vegan but I have tried to find real evidence that is healthy for many years. Unfortunately what I find is people whose health deteriorates in the long-term. I would love to see some real science into the causes to make veganism a real healthy option, but there are so many red flags with veganism that I doubt it would be proven healthy.

    3. What you do is who you are. The actions you perform make who you are. The choices you make defines your personality.

  2. I believe that humans have a higher consciousness than animals and therefore if animals kill to live we should not follow their path. Also animals only kill when they are hungry but humans kill for gluttony. Not all vegetarians are spiritual people, but I think all people that are on the spiritual path should be vegetarians/vegans. And don’t care what Tolle decides for himself, but to me I have no respect for his meat eating habit. I mean common in this day and age when we have such amazing vegetarian choices for food why inflict pain and cruelty on other sentient beings? It is just unnecessary.

    1. Well the reason would be for health Mark. Vegetarianism is doable for some people health-wise, but the dairy industry is crueler even than the meat industry. So the question is whether veganism is healthy for humans long-term. There are many problems with vegan diets, many “red flags.” I wish it were simple but the truth is that many people run into serious health problems on a vegan diet. The main point in this article is that enlightenment does not necessarily mean a person then chooses vegetarianism.

      1. What problems do they run into? I have heard of none (that aren’t eother fabrications or complete and utter lies) Yet I can list endless number that stem from a standard diet. Cancer, diabetes, heart disease, to name the most obvious.

      2. We must be very careful about cause and effect. The industrialization of food is hugely detrimental to health but the problems aren’t caused by eating animal foods as I understand it. The leading edge thinkers point to seed oils high in omega 6, refined flour, soy, excess salt and sugar. And of course, CAFOs and their associated practices cause many issues, including a reduction in omega 3, the over use of antibiotics and other drugs, etc. And lets not forget the billions of pounds of chemical poisons sprayed onto food. Cause and effect is hard to nail down because of the immense number of interacting factors. But we simply need to look at nature as a guiding principle and then review research in that light to bring us as close as possible to what is optimal for humans.

      3. Well, that would take a bigger answer than could possibly be fitted into a blog comment. It’s a huge subject. I will say though that I have been researching health and happiness for over 2 decades, and I’ve come across many accounts from ex-vegans describing health melt-downs. The causes of these meltdowns are many and synergistic. If you’re interested, http://www.beyondveg.com/ goes into a lot of detail with all the issues, and I like the book “The Vegetarian Myth” by Lierre Keith, an ex-vegan herself, who eloquently presents an alternative viewpoint to the vegan party line.

      4. Michael – stop worrying about your health – worry about the animals you are so keen on eating – only then will you find peace.

      5. I don’t worry about either, but I do ponder all matters relating to how we live. The subject of animals is extremely complex. Take a look at “The Vegetarian Myth” by Lierre Keith for a broad overview of the issues. Lierre was a vegan for 20 years.

    2. You are totally right Mark, Eckhart Tolle is wrong on this one. In eating meat he is inflicting un-necessary cruelty and that can not be right in my eyes. It demonstrates a lack of compassion and a strong attachment to a desire to eat animal flesh. Eckhart Tolle can be brilliant, but he seems to have a blind spot here for some reason.

      1. I was vegetarian for decades, got very ill and then got well again by going towards a high fat, low carb paleo diet (after trying veganism and raw foodism and getting worse). There is nothing wrong with meat for health. Grains are far more of a problem, and if you have no tendency towards autoimmune you may never notice this, except for your expanding waistline, which you will just blame on the natural process of ageing, which it is not. If you do get autoimmune you will maybe be forced, like I was, to look again at your fixed views about vegetarianism and how it’s healthy and better for animals. I abhor animal cruelty as much as any vegetarian, which is why I only eat wild caught fish and grass fed animals. I will not eat factory farmed animals or their dairy products. Also, there are more species harmed and made extinct by the swathes of land stolen for grain and soy production than there would be if the fields were left as grazing and the happy animals who grazed there were killed humanely and eaten. So, as an ex vegetarian, I have to 100% agree with Michael. Also, I have been meditating since the 70s and can say that a high fat low carb diet, which includes moderate protein, creates a far more settled atmosphere in the body for deep experience than did the grain and sugar based diet I was on for so many years. I even wrote a book in the 90s extolling the benefits of vegetarianism, but I have to say I was wrong, and now have a website giving out far better info. There are many cultures who have a long history of “enlightened” masters who are not vegetarian. Vegetarianism in spirituality is a silly old meme stemming from Hinduism, and look at India now – the autoimmune capital of the world! If you’re not ill yet from a grain-based vegetarian diet, it’s just luck or a strong digestion – it’s not because of it.

      2. Thanks for your story Phil, it’s one I’ve been hearing over and over, about health failures on vegetarian and vegan diets. I even read about one guy who couldn’t make progress with his spiritual practice until he started eating meat again.

        “… a high fat low carb diet, which includes moderate protein, creates a far more settled atmosphere in the body for deep experience than did the grain and sugar based diet…”

        Yes, I watched a video presentation by Nora Gedgaudas on Vimeo, who suffered 35 years of depression and healed on a high percentage fat “primal diet.” She has a book, Primal Body, Primal Mind, and she says the most damaged and hard to treat people she sees in her practice are vegetarians and vegans. She says that a high fat diet is very stabilizing for the mind.

        I’ve read two great books recently that echo your story, The Vegetarian Myth by Lierre Keith and The Meat Fix by British guy John Nicholson.

        I’ve noticed as well, that many of the raw food movement leaders are now adding in raw animal foods, like yogurt. Many are open about the failures of raw food veganism.

      3. You are welcome Michael. I guess you found my blog post too on whether we are veggie on my site… Living in an area where lots of TM meditators live, I wrote that so I can stop arguing with them individually when they ask how I’ve transformed my body and health and then say, “Eew, I couldn’t eat meeeeeeeat!” :) Yes, I have seen Lierre Keith, and laughed out loud many times while reading The Meat Fix. Essential reading for any vegetarian! :)

      4. I’m actually promoting The Vegetarian Myth as essential reading for veg*ns. It’s the best grounding of all the issues I’ve seen so far. Really, the answer isn’t veg*nism, it’s permaculture, getting back on the land, healing the land and ourselves, creating abundant life. Nature is the answer to everything. These are funny times, I think the signs are there that we are heading for some massive shifts. Yeah I saw your blog, I like :-)

  3. The thought that sticks out in my mind more than anything else is that we are one life. We all rely on one another for our existence and even the tiniest of amoebas eats all sorts of other little amoebas. Kale is just as alive to me as a rhinoceros and in my opinion, nothing is more “sentient” than anything else. What is sentience? Being alive an knowing that you are alive? A tree knows it’s alive and a tree knows it’s loved and needed. We all feel.

    1. It’s great to get your perspective on it Dez, it’s really wonderful to know you have been through these battles and thoughts. I will ponder your ideas on sentience, and maybe I’ll have to go kill a pig and make sausages like you did :-) For me, it’s the LIFE we subject animals to that is my greatest concern. These CAFOs have got to go. OH and a wonderful thing… the bit in Food Inc, with Joel Salatin where he stands in front of the field with that herd in the long grass. It seemed so natural and good. I think they need to be shot on the spot though and not sent to abattoirs?

      And in “paradise,” I think many animals we use for food etc, could be free roaming, living completely natural lives. When life is ABUNDANT, the taking of life doesn’t seem so bad. In the Serengeti, the herds of wildebeest are millions, in the old America, millions of buffalo were in a herd.

      1. Mmm I totally feel you that the life of the animal is what matters. It is important that the animals live as natural a life as possible. This year I’d like to learn about hunting and trapping animals so they are living a natural life in their own paradise until their end. Every life comes to a close and shifts into something new, but it’s the life that matters. The animals I eat come from farmers that raise them nearby, grassfed and eating little to no grains at all. They are living close to a natural life, but they are still moved somewhere else for slaughter so they can legally be sold to consumers.. I don’t like that. I prefer the animal to be killed in it’s natural habitat and not be put through such stress before it’s final breath.

  4. im sorry but most of eckharts work seems to be rehashed krishnamurti teachings..very well done mind you.. he is very smart and targets his market well. he certainly does not say anyhting controversial.. unlike K.. who told it like it was.

      1. Absolutely true. I would like to see the end of cruelty to animals as an urgent priority and the development of permaculture systems, where emphasis is given to allowing animals to live naturally. The truth is Mae, that there is no death-free food, for example when a field is prepared for grain by cutting down forest, death is involved.. a lot of death… the life that is there now is taken, and the life that would have existed for millennia, denied. Insect life is killed by pesticides, mammals and nesting birds are killed at harvest. We must envision a way of living in harmony with nature. Permaculture is the most advanced system for that. Nature exists symbiotically, and when we destroy nature for growing monocrops, we KILL millions of species living out their natural lives. Nature is the answer, for health, for food, for the environment. Natural systems are the way to create abundant life. Perhaps you could have a look at the way humans live naturally in nature… tribes. I have studied for years, it gives a valuable perspective.

  5. I agree with the point that animals eat animals – but animals do not torture other animals in dimensions that this industry does. I don`t think it is wrong to eat meat. I think it is wrong how the animals are tortured to make prophit. I don`t think hunters that eat meat are wrong like in the Jungle for example.

    But that ongoing massive torture in industry farming is just insane and thats a point Eckhart made in a new earth also. I think if we do eat meat – we must buy it from where we know that animals are being treated with love and respect. Like some regional small organic farms or something. it is our choice what we buy.

    1. Being treated with love and respect, really? and then eat them eventually? no killing can be done humanely

      1. Very true

        UG Krishnamurti : Meditation means attention, care. That’s part of it, care for my children, for my neighbour, for my country, for the earth, for the earth, for the trees, for the animals. Don’t kill animals. You follow? Don’t kill them to eat. It’s so unnecessary. It’s part of the tradition which says, you must eat meat. Therefore, sir, all this comes to a sense of deep, inward seriousness, and that seriousness itself brings about attention, caring and responsibility and all that we have discussed. It isn’t that one has gone through all this. One sees it. And the very perception is action which is wisdom. Because wisdom is the ending of suffering. It isn’t callous, callousness, the ending of it. And the ending of it means the observation, the seeing of suffering. Not to go beyond it, to refuse it, rationalize it or run away from it. Just to see it. Let it flower. And as you are choicelessly aware of this flowering, it comes naturally to wither away. I don’t have to do something about it.

        18th Conversation with Dr. Allan W. Anderson, San Diego, 1974

        Krishnamurti on Eating Meat & Vegetarianism

        Krishnamurti: Is that really a very great problem, whether we should have an egg or not? Perhaps most of you are concerned with non-killing. What is really the crux of the matter, is it not? Perhaps most of you eat meat or fish. You avoid killing by going to a butcher, or you put the blame on the killer, the butcher – that is only dodging the problem. If you like to eat eggs, you may get infertile eggs to avoid killing. But this is a very superficial question – the problem is much deeper. You don’t want to kill animals for your stomach, but you do not mind supporting governments that are organized to kill.

        1950 3rd Public Talk, Colombo, Ceylon

        http://www.krishnamurtiaustralia.org/articles/vegetarian.htm

  6. Eating animals or harming animals really saddens me. There is no reason for human beings to create an industry out of killing. Let the world be as it is. We can rise above the world, and take our places as caretakers of this beautiful planet. Love.

  7. I love The Power of Now and believe ET is one of the true prophets of our time. That said, if he eats meat (which is completely unnecessary and unhealthy), he is causing unnecessary suffering as well as polluting the planet. Methane production is actually a bigger cause of global warming than carbon emissions. How can a person so disciplined and peaceful as ET cause such harm to himself, to innocent animals (mostly vegans themselves) and to the planet? Clearly, he dodges that question because he is guilty about it. We’re to believe that he doesn’t want to influence others about his personal lifestyle choices!? Come on! He’s the single most influential “spiritual guru” on the planet! He just knows that a lot of the people who buy his books are more compassionate than he is. He’s just protecting his brand/profits. Otherwise, why wouldn’t he speak as openly about that topic as he does about being conscious and present in the now? He’s originally from the meat-heavy country of Germany and is 65 years old. Some habits are hard to break, especially at his age. At least we know the man doesn’t walk on water. By the way, the story of Jesus and the fish is largely interpreted as symbolic, fish representing peace at the time. All accounts in the bible about Jesus is that he was a vegetarian and locals there to this day know that he was an Essene, which is a vegetarian sect of Judaism.

  8. I forgot to add that I’ve been vegetarian since 1993 and vegan since 2000. According to my omnivore doctor, my health consistently checks out far better than other patients my age. The notion that some people need to eat meat can not be proven scientifically. The risks of eating meat and dairy far outweigh any perceived benefits. I have never found a shred of evidence suggesting that meat and dairy was essential for anything the plant world couldn’t offer. Don’t forget that vegans can be unhealthy too if they just eat junk food (which many do). This isn’t rocket science people. The science is out there now and it all points to vegans living, on average, 15 years longer than meat eaters. You can hate that inconvenient truth all you want, but you ultimately will never escape it. It all makes common sense doesn’t it? Eat with compassion and the universe will in turn treat YOU with compassion, even giving you extra years of human life. When we’re fully conscious, we have no choice but to be vegan. Just walk up to a cow and see if you naturally start salivating. Do you have the urge to suck milk from that cow? Are you salivating to sink your teeth into that animal? Of course you aren’t unless you’re a complete freak of nature. There are mental institutes for that, thankfully. There are films about such people with names like Hannibal Lector. Now try the same experiment with apples or any other fruit on a tree. I rest my case!

  9. What i see in many of the comments here people saying things like “eckhart is wrong”, “vegetarianism is best” (paraphrase)…. What all of these types of thinking do is to set up a scenario where the people saying these things have chosen for themselves a way of life of vegetarian eating but then insist that everyone else live this way as well or else they get “torched” because “they are being so cruel and unkind”. This kind of self centered thinking and insisting the whole world think the same way is what is problematic as i see it. Just because there are books, literature, websites proving that vegetarian and vegan diets are more spiritual, of higher mind, and healthier doesn’t mean anything. It simply means that anyone who wants to choose this life can use this literature and those that want to stay in the thinking “i am right and anyone who doesnt agree or who eats meat is wrong” can have literature to back it up. I used to be vegetarian for years. Now i eat meat- mainly for the substantial health benefits that my body found in meat and in the research that i have looked into for the past 10 years. I do not need anyone else to agree nor do i disagree with anyone who is vegetarian. There is just as much literature in the pro-meat side. Its a personal choice. Anyone insisting that everyone else go along with THEIR WAY of eating and quoting books/websites/etc is not really giving due respect to fellow humans ability to choose best for themselves.

    I used to live in an area where a lot of people built strawbale houses. Sort of a hippie community. I built and lived in a strawbale house too. I helped others during the building of theirs. There were people that would scold the “general public” for living “on the grid” using electricity, or for living in wasteful houses, and all sorts of crap like this. Ultimately i stopped hanging around as i started to understand that little cliques get formed around all sorts of stuff. Its like junior high school. Oh your not a vegetarian your not cool. Oh you eat meat you are such a lower spiritual being.

    I think it best and the most mature stance to choose wisely for one self the best choice for self and allow others to think and choose for themselves.

    I personally do not think a kale plant is any less sentient or valuable than a cow. What if the kale objects just as the cow objects. What if the cow gladly offers its life to feed humans like the kale. Anyone claiming the ultimate answer is not trustworthy.

    Anyone i have ever met who plays the vegetarianism is best – my expeience of them has always been that they read litrrature or websites or were part of a group or followed teachings in promoting that vegetarianism is holy-er or better etc. They failed to see that the promoters dont necessarily know and even change their minds.
    Again- i used to not eat meat. Now i do. So what. So what if eckhart does or does not. Eating meat or not eating meat does not mean anything with regards to a persons spiritual path. It is more a matter of personal choice. Making judgements on eckhart or anyone (for the simple fact that they eat meat) says much more about the inner life of the person making the judgements than it does about the person making those choices.

  10. Also keep in mind that a lot of people say things like “all the evidence out there points to (fill in the blank) being the most healthy” or some variation of this. Anyone can find information or LACK of information on the internet that supports their current thinking. People that are suggesting a way of eating or believing etc typically will locate only that research that backs up their point and undermine any research that is in conflict with their point. That is why the whole “all the research supports” card is pure fallacy. What is not realized fully is that it is not Eckhart’s job to tell people how to think, what to eat, etc. Too much uppity spiritual crap tied into the whole eating thing anyway.

  11. It seems to me that if you really want to be free you must be willing to give up all preconceived notions and live in the moment. Having no identify means not labeling oneself vegan or anything else. In that freedom the force that has created all things may have your body eating meat and it may not. It is not for you to decide. Only the ego in its arrogance will decide that it knows better than being itself.

      1. No worries Phil. In other news, I was on my walk yesterday and I saw a heron. A thought popped into my head “The fish transformed into a heron.” Weird eh? :-) Meaning life is a dynamic play of forms — everything is eating everything else, and nature keeps perfect balance when left alone. Someone told me that herons eat the cute ducklings that are around right now, the cutest things ever aren’t they? My human mind feels sad… thanks Walt :-)

      2. I am lucky in that I feel no sadness at that. As a kid (and adult) my pets/favourite animals were snakes mostly, so I have never been overly biased towards Walt’s furry/feathered favourites (not that I have anything against them). It’s all perfect, and in the spirit of Eckhart, since this is “his” thread, the heron was the fish long before it ate it, and you were/are the heron, and the fish… :)

  12. What are the authors sources of information? There is only the very brief statement that Kim Eng says that Tolle eats meat, but there is no evidence that she said this, or a direct quote of any kind. How can one base an entire article about Tolle’s supposed meat eating with so little information, evidence or references? I would love to hear more about Tolle’s take on eating meat, but this article doesn’t seem to be very well researched or supported.

    1. Eckhart is the real deal, and he does not recommend vegetarianism, he says listen to your body, be present with food and see whether there is an inner contraction or expansion at the perception/idea of a certain food. So, it really doesn’t matter what his personal expansions or contractions are. Fact is, if being veggie was synonymous with being spiritual, he would advise it, he does not. If memory serves, I got the info from an article on Eckhart Tolle’s own site, although it may have been removed. As I said, he constantly dodges the question. Also there is an interesting statement from Jesus in the Gospel of Thomas about lions you might want to check out.

  13. Thanks for the reply Michael. I still think you need to have better references if you are going to claim that Tolle is a meat eater, but putting that aside I pretty much agree with your interpretation of Tolle’s teachings on diet. My main trouble with most meat eaters is how separated they are from actually killing and butchering the animal, and thus the reality of the whole situation. Can you imagine Eckhart Tolle looking an animal in the eyes, an animal like a cow or pig or tender young lamb or calf, then cutting it’s throat and watching it’s blood drain out, then butchering the animal. Humans share a lot in common with animals, and in fact any sensitive human with an open heart I think would find this whole process utterly horrifying. And imagine how the animal feels.

    If Eckhart Tolle does eat meat though I wouldn’t be surprised, because he is a millionaire who drives a Jaguar and an Infinity, and lives in a luxury condo. I really don’t understand a lot of his teachings in the context of how he lives his life. If we are all one, and the ego is an illusion he shouldn’t mind giving me a little bit of his millions, or give me the keys to his Jaguar. Or maybe he could give me his dog to eat when I run out of pigs. Maybe he could donate most of his fortunes to charity and help some of the starving people in the world.

    By the way, I actually do love a lot of Tolle’s teachings. But I would love to sit down with him and ask him some tough questions. I watch the videos on his website where people ask him questions and I have yet to see anyone give him a really hard question. It’s easy to talk about “presence” when you have had a relatively easy life like his, and now on top of all of this he is famous and wealthy. And even in this midst of his wealth he still charges exorbitant amounts for people attend his talks, and charges fees to watch his videos on the internet.

    1. You’re right, I definitely should have noted the reference, it’s a shame I can’t find it now, it seems to have been removed, although it’s fairly well accepted that he is not vegetarian. People have seen him in restaurants etc, and I got the info from Kim Eng! It was an Q/A with her, I do remember that. There are a couple of references on the net but not much. As I say, he clearly does not want to talk about the issue and for good reason…. people will JUDGE him for it, and incorrectly IMO. Eckhart sees life as a dynamic whole, life eats life. If you are a seer, and you have a higher perspective, people will LITERALLY CRUCIFY you for that perspective, that TRUER perspective.

      I know exactly your feeling about killing but I am conflicted (this is the mind of course, the conflict is mental, a battle of thoughts). Am I conflicted if I don’t think? No. Trouble is, I spent years researching nutrition and alas, it is clear to me that we do need animal foods to be healthy.

      https://happy.guide/2014/03/16/vegan-diet

      Is it fair to say that if someone who HAS NEVER had to kill to eat CANNOT kill, then they SHOULD NOT eat it? I think not. Children who are hunter-gatherers are not squeamish about it, and therefore, the condition comes about because of culture. We live in a culture where we grow up watching Bambi and hundreds of other cartoons depicting animals with human emotions. And we never have to actually kill. So it’s a very strange and unnatural situation.

      I believe it is good to look to nature for answers. In Lierre Keith’s book The Vegetarian Myth, she recalls a conversation on a vegan message board where they actually seriously talked about how good it would be to partition the Serengeti and keep the carnivores on one side (they can live on grass), and the herbivores on the other. In reality, nature is exquisitely balanced and every part plays its part in the health of the whole. I recently saw an article on wolves and how they benefit the environment in so many ways. In a national park in the USA, wolves were reintroduced to provide these benefits — the herbivores were failing WITHOUT them. We need a broader and truer view of nature.

      If you want to look at what is natural for any species, then look at that species in the wild, how it lives and eats in nature. Humans hunt and gather, without exception.

      I agree with you about Eckhart’s lifestyle to some extent, I was very disappointed after The Power of Now, when all these other materials came out, and it just became a typical marketing exercise. That does not jive with me at all. But really who are we to judge? There are so many SHOULDS in your statement. SHOULD according to you, but I’m sure Eckhart does not MIND. He ALLOWS life to take whatever path it takes and TRUSTS that things work out perfectly.

      Who am I to say he should or should not live a certain way? Perhaps his lifestyle is countering the paradigm, that spirituality and lack of material possessions go together. Osho was another who scoffed at that idea. Only recently has the IDEA of abundance been attached to spiritual memes.

      “How spiritual you are means how PRESENT you are.” ~ Eckhart Tolle. END OF STORY, no other DEFINITION. So by what mechanism do we judge Eckhart’s food choices or car choices? A conditioned idea, and THAT is NOT spiritual. If we want to understand people like Eckhart, then we have to BE like them, there is no other way. Words do nothing to give experience. And when you reach that state, be careful what truths you speak of, because people will crucify you. People hate having their world view and their beliefs threatened, and they will fight tooth and nail to defend them, even from (especially from) the truth.

      Lierre Keith’s book is a good one to read by the way, for a different perspective and one I share. Lierre was vegan for 20 years. I feel, like Eckhart actually, that we should end cruelty, industrial farming methods, move into holistic ways of producing food and then see where that takes us. If you take an acre field of wheat and compare what is happening there, the death to existing life, the chemicals, the soil erosion etc and compare that same acre put to permaculture, the benefits are incredible. I think if you care about LIFE, then the big picture is a lot more than the question of whether to eat animals. There is no death-free food. We need to understand the big picture to make better choices. Health is part of that too… and health and the environment, allowing animals freedom to live natural lives, care for the Earth etc. can all be achieved holistically.

  14. I find the answers from these spiritual masters frustrating. Be present, operate from the vortex, see what feels right. The question we all really want to know the answer to is: “When a person is spiritually enlightened, how will they feel about eating meat?” But none of them provide a clear answer.

    For me, the most important question is: “What is a healthy diet for a human being?” If our optimal diet includes meat (which it certainly seems to), then the individual must first decide if they’re happy to be sub-optimal.

    1. Well, the silence is deafening. If vegetarianism and being enlightened were synonymous, then they would clearly state so. But we don’t have Jesus saying “Blessed are the vegetarians.” But the opposite is the case, Abraham and Eckhart are basically saying “get out of your mind and FEEL if your Inner Being wants it.” THAT means dropping all ideas and being completely honest in the moment.

      The conflict for me comes with the fact that we don’t ourselves do the killing. How would my Inner Being feel about killing? People say that if abattoirs had windows everyone would be vegetarian but this isn’t true. In other countries I have seen animals displayed in the street… like whole sheep’s head, and for them it is normal.

      Is it just my IDEAS that are confused, conflicted? My Inner Being seems to love roast chicken :-)

      Anyway, the fact is clear that enlightenment (Oneness with Being) does NOT cause a repulsion of animal foods. And Abraham is clear that our Source, would lead us to non-vegan foods.

      I remember reading about Kabbalah and that in their theology, it’s actually an obligation to eat animals, and that it transforms that energy.

      I think if I was really hungry and living in nature, it would be a no-brainer. And all inner conflict would be gone. :-)

      1. Yeah… reminds of when I was on holiday once and there was a native guy catching fish by basically spearing them with a pointy stick. It was so easy! He was spearing one every few seconds. And it FELT so natural, it really stuck in my mind. Another thing that stuck in my mind was the guy who did the raw food experiment in the zoo… eating like an ape, and when they had a chance for a bit of fish he said I’m glad it was cooked but I would have eaten it raw.

        Also, there was a feral girl found in France, and she lived on frogs, rabbits, fish, leaves and roots… lots of animal foods.

  15. You can bet Eckhart does not eat meat from factory farms and slaughterhouses. This is one of the worst apologist articles ever.. You clearly choose what parts you pay attention to..

    “How is it possible that humans killed in excess of 100 million fellow humans in the twentieth century alone? Humans inflicting pain of such magnitude on one another is beyond anything you can imagine. And that’s not taking into account the mental, emotional and physical violence, the torture, pain, and cruelty they continue to inflict on each other as well as on other sentient beings on a daily basis. Do they act in this way because they are in touch with their natural state, the joy of life within? Of course not. Only people who are in a deeply negative state, who feel very bad indeed, would create such a reality as a reflection of how they feel. Now they are engaged in destroying nature and the planet that sustains them. Unbelievable but true. Humans are a dangerously insane and very sick species. That’s not a judgment. Ifs a fact.” (The Power Of Now)

    Then let your peace flow into whatever you do and you will be working on the levels of effect and cause simultaneously. This also applies if you are supporting a movement designed to stop deeply unconscious humans from destroying themselves, each other, and the planet, or from continuing to inflict dreadful suffering on other sentient beings. Remember: Just as you cannot fight the darkness, so you cannot fight unconsciousness. If you try to do so, the polar opposites will become strengthened and more deeply entrenched. You will become identified with one of the polarities, you will create an “enemy,” and so be drawn into unconsciousness yourself. Raise awareness by disseminating information, or at the most, practice passive resistance. But make sure that you carry no resistance within, no hatred, no negativity. (The Power Of Now).

    With the timeless dimension comes a different kind of knowing, one that does not “kill” the spirit that lives within every creature and every thing. A knowing that does not destroy the sacredness and mystery of life but contains a deep love and reverence for all that is. (The Power Of Now)

    Another aspect of the collective dysfunction of the human mind is the unprecedented violence that humans are inflicting on other lifeforms and the planet itself ­ the destruction of oxygenproducing forests and other plant and animal life; illtreatment of animals in factory farms; and poisoning of rivers, oceans, and air. Driven by greed, ignorant of their connectedness to the whole, humans persist in behavior that, if continued unchecked, can only result in their own destruction. (A New Earth)

    Once there is a certain degree of presence, of still and alert attention in human beings’ perceptions, they can sense the divine life essence, the one indwelling consciousness or spirit in every creature, every lifeform, recognize it as one with their own essence and so love it as themselves. (A New Earth)

    The stronger the ego, the stronger the sense of separateness between people. The only actions that do not cause opposing reactions are those that are aimed at the good of all. They are inclusive, not exclusive. They join; they don’t separate. They are not for “my” country but for all of humanity, not for “my” religion but the emergence of consciousness in all human beings, not for “my” species but for all sentient beings and all of nature. (A New Earth)

    In the forest, there is an incomprehensible order that to the mind looks like chaos. It is beyond the mental categories of god and bad. You cannot understand it through thought, but you can sense it when you let go of thought, become still and alert, and don’t try to understand or explain. Only then can you be aware of the sacredness of the forest. As soon as you sense that hidden harmony, that sacredness, you realize you are not separate from it, and when you realize that, you become a conscious participant in it. (A New Earth)

    1. I don’t see anything there about not eating animals Joe. Actions speak louder, Eckhart “eats anything” according to Kim Eng. Unfortunately we have a system of economics which creates the madness. Every time a consumer chooses lowest price, it’s a vote for cruelty and abuse.

      The answer to all the insanity is the creation of community, and a massive return to nature, producing food in natural ecosystems. The need for money of each individual is at the very roots of the insanity. Only last night I saw about the millions of tons of mercury polluting nature in Peru due to illegal gold mining. What is the root cause? No social guarantee of well-being for the individual. Leaving the individual to fight and compete, otherwise why bother with gold? If you are born in a village that looks like paradise, where food is grown as far as the eye can see, growing naturally, where all that is needed is available. where is the need to pollute, to cheat, to be greedy? Where is the need for money? If you want to talk about solving REAL problems of evil, the REAL causes of suffering, then “the system” is it.

      Why would any farmer have to use methods to cut costs without competition? Competition is the insanity, it causes people to make bad decisions against life, against people and nature. It ain’t about eating animals or not, believe me, monoculture, agriculture is the biggest KILLER there is. A field of wheat is absolutely dripping in blood. If you care about LIFE, then you create abundant ecosystems, not kill millions of acres and plant one crop and then continue to kill via chemicals, via the death and destruction involved in fossil fuels, carbon inputs as fertilizer etc.

      If you truly care about solving problems created by humans then the answers are co-operation, sharing and creation of abundant self-maintaining ecosystems for food.

      1. Eckhart Tolle’s teaching is primarily to awaken, then awakened action will result from an awakened consciousness. People who live in 3rd world countries or in arid or cold climates, and in cultures that have to produce their own food may not be able to be vegetarian. We have supermarkets, they don’t. No spiritual person would want that fellow members of their society have to harden their hearts inflicting harm on other sentient beings in slaughter houses. Wayne Dyer does mention in his new book I Can See Clearly Now that he does not eat meat because he does not want to contribute to fear in the world , which the animals feel. Concern for the suffering of sentient beings is going vegan.

      2. If awakened action meant being vegan then Eckhart would be, but he isn’t.

        Killing doesn’t mean suffering. Lions hunt herbivores, a dance that’s been going on for millennia, perhaps you would advocate removing all the lions from Earth, so as to prevent suffering of wildebeest and gazelles. But then why stop at lions?… let’s take out every species that eats another species, chameleons, birds, dolphins, venus fly traps… etc. Long list, prob 70% of life on Earth.

      3. Lions will go vegan after humans go vegan first. Humans are herbivores, our physiology is like that of large primates like gorillas. Where do gorillas get their protein?

        “Since all worlds are interconnected, when collective human consciousness becomes transformed, nature and the animal kingdom will reflect that transformation. Hence the statement in the Bible that in the coming age “The lion shall lie down with the lamb.” This points to the possibility of a completely different order of reality. …We are not separate from our world, so when the majority of humans become free of egoic delusion, this inner change will affect all of creation. You will literally inhabit a new world ” The Power of Now

      4. No, our small intestine is twice the relative volume and our colon half the relative volume of other primates. Gorillas get their protein by consuming huge amounts of vegetation, and fermenting fibers in their huge guts, providing them with a diet high in the resulting fats. Humans can’t do this. The gorilla/protein argument is frankly laughable. We can’t handle much fiber at all.

        Maybe there will be a different order of reality. In this one though, my brain and body need a level of nutrition that science now has clearly identified, and that fits entirely with our evolution as hunter-gatherers. E.g. a certain need for EFAs, in a certain ratio. When you take all the puzzle pieces and view through the lens of evolution, it all fits. And that ain’t veganism.

        And every time you quote from The Power of Now or A New Earth, you simply reinforce my point that enlightened people who would say such things, still “eat anything.”

      5. And by the way, the Bible is chock full of symbolism. Taking everything literally will lead to errors of understanding. Much of what is written is intended to create understanding by causing a search for meaning, and a certain resonance with the deeper self. The resonance creates a curiosity and interest but the mind is confused, and therefore you have a search for meaning.

  16. Lions would also gladly eat humans and sometimes do. Many people are killed by predators. The purpose of animals is not to awaken but the purpose of humans is to awaken. If a human kills another human to eat their meat, then why it is wrong since “all is one consciousness” anyway? Cows and other animals will run away in fear and fight for their life, but they are killed against their will. Animals cannot choose compassion. Eating meat requires suppressing your compassion. Killing is violence. If killing animals against their will can be justified, then why not murder rape and slavery too? If you love another being as you would yourself, then you would not selfishly harm it. We are here to evolve which means having respect and compassion for all beings and contributing to the least amount of harm.

    1. If a vegan is physically and mentally broken after 20 years on the diet, where does your compassion lie now?

      If a 100,000 acres of rainforest is cleared to grow palms for palm oil, where is your compassion?

      If a child is mentally disabled from being poisoned by Roundup sprayed on genetically engineered corn fields, where is your compassion?

      If a family live in part of the world that is rocky, no crops grow, but livestock can be kept to provide a livelihood, where is your compassion?

      Is your compassion for the baby gazelle being hunted, or for the lions cubs who are hungry?

      1. If you buy animal products then you are supporting genetically modified food companies. 75% of the farmland in the US is used to grow grain for animal feed, mostly genetically modified corn and soy beans, which are sprayed with roundup, and fed to animals. The pesticide and other toxins are stored in their fat which can’t be washed off. If you eat conventional animal products you are eating pesticides. The reason that meat is so cheap is that grains are heavily subsidized. It takes 16 pounds of grain to make one pound of beef. Animals are fed grains because it fattens them quicker. Imagine if this land was used to grow healthy food for humans instead. Most of the forest in the US and in the Amazon is being cleared to grow grain for animal feed.
        If cows were fed only grass meat would cost over $25 a pound because there is not enough land to feed enough cows. GMO corn and soy beans are grown because they give the most tons of carbohydrates and fat per acre. Super Immunity by Dr. Joel Fuhrman explains the ideal diet. Wheat, sugar and processed foods are empty calories, but animal products are considered empty calories too.
        Fact: 75% of Americans re overweight, 40% die from heart disease and 25% die from cancer, because what you reap is what you sow.

      2. I’m not in favor of industrial agriculture or growing grain to feed cows. This is not a natural model. I disagree with Joel Fuhrman’s approach to nutrition, it doesn’t actually work, it doesn’t actually fit with cutting edge science for things like essential fatty acids. People’s health go downhill long-term on vegan diets. It can take 20 years.

        If we look to NATURE for the answers, they are there, both for our health and for the environment. Cutting rainforest to grow grain is not in harmony with nature, but natural prairie is turning to desert, prairie that would and SHOULD feed herbivores. In a rainforest environment, use species that are natural to that ecology. It’s a simple and sane answer.

        Use the land to provide abundance, growing what is natural. Very simple.

        When you have a system where each person is responsible for their own welfare, you create insanity. People will go after the money because they have to provide their own security. This create evil outcomes (outcomes of suffering, bad feelings). Billions of bad decisions are made every day to choose personal security over what is good for people and nature.

        A return to nature and community has every answer built in. Every problem is addressed by it, every bad feeling healed by it. The answers are there right now, but it’s not veganism, which will destroy health and mean that land suitable for livestock that would naturally be there is not useable. Grain based agriculture is the most destructive practice on the planet. And humans aren’t naturally grain eaters.

        You see the whole solution is holistic… what will heal humans, what will heal the planet is nature, using nature as a model, as a guide. It’s all there… nature exists as ecology, a synergy of countless animals and plants interacting. Humans are the ones out of step.

        It’s not hard to look at anything at all in the light of nature and immediately see the red flag. By using what is locally a resource, by caring for it sustainably, by sharing networks and community so that no person’s welfare comes before another’s, worldwide ubuntu, then we have sanity restored. The system is currently way out of step with human nature. It’s easy to look at what is there now and see “it is NOT GOOD.”

        Community, sharing, nature, solve everything. It’s a way off, but it’s coming. Veganism will just create more suffering. Humans are not naturally vegans.

      3. Joel Fuhrman and the nutritionist Gary Null have been vegan most of their life. Gary Null is 69 and he has been vegan for over 40 years. You can get ALL the essential fats from greens, beans and seeds and nuts. Your body converts omega 3 into DHEA.

      4. And you didn’t tell me where your compassion lies in those circumstances, it’s more complex than your simplified world view. Veganism does not provide the answers we need, but community, creating abundance, sharing, nature, these things do have all the answers.

      5. The body is generally not efficient at converting plant-based omega 3, which is why we are now seeing algae-derived DHA and EPA on the market, and it gets worse with age. The same is true of many nutrients e.g. vitamin A.

        If you are really eager to make a vegan diet work, then you are going to last longer for sure. There are so many red flags with vegan diets, but you can ameliorate many of them by being very careful. This care will not parlay to the general population however, who are very sloppy and undisciplined generally… and rightly so, they are busy living their lives.

        Using nutritional science you can last longer before your health nose-dives, by supplementing B12, DHA + EPA, choline etc but the diet is not robust at all, and I see no value in it, because all the solutions for our health and that of nature do not require it. And people won’t even do it, they like animal foods for good reason, we evolved for the last 2 and a half million years because of them, no animal foods, no big brain, no human.

        The whole vegan dogma is just a house of cards — flaky and lacking any logical credibility whatsoever.

        Oh, and a diet based on the foods you mentioned will mean a terrible omega-3 to omega-6 ratio which will promote inflammation. And all the grains you’re eating are going to cause intestinal permeability and other problems leading to autoimmune diseases. ETC, The list of red flags is very long indeed.

  17. Read Dr.Joel Fuhrman’s best sellers, Eat To Live and Super Immunity. They are completely based on science, and recommend a healthy vegan diet. He mentions that as long as you get your calories from whole food you will get 60-80 grams or more of protein per 2000 calories which is more than enough. We can get all the essential amino acids and fats from plants. Joel Fuhrman mentions that about half the calories in green vegetables come from protein and about a quarter from fat.

      1. Important: Presented here is the proposition that Lierre keith’s experience as presented in her book (for profit) called the vegetarian Myth is not a reliable authority on vegan diets for the following reasons.

        1) Lierre keith herself admits in her own book she “often cheated” eating animal products; ie not only was her diet not vegan but was not even vegetarian.

        2) Lierre admits to long term health challenges (pre exisiting her move to supposed vegan diet/see above point) so to attribute a decline in health (existing before and during dietary choices) to her diet does not demonstrate causation.

        a recommended read, Paleo fantasy.

      2. Hi Ian, “for profit” is a ludicrous attempt to trash Lierre’s work by questioning her motive. Low, very low. All books make profit. Eckhart Tolle’s Power of Now also made profit.

        1. She “cheated” because of intense cravings for animal foods, which suggest the body intensely desiring/wanting/needing those foods, rather than “she didn’t stick to a vegan diet 0.01% of the time so her health failures are because she failed.” Again, a ludicrous argument.

        2. I have read The Vegetarian Myth and do not recall mention of pre-existing health problem. Please provide a reference. A healthful diet will facilitate healing, not decline.

        It is not only Lierre Keith’s testimony that the evidence for inadequacy of vegan diets rests. There are thousands of personal stories of failure on vegan diets as well as clear scientific evidence of the lack of adequate nutrition. Like much nutrition fad, veganism is a house of cards, and Lierre’s book is an excellent place to start looking at the reasons why.

      3. Paleo is the caveman diet; for people with caveman consciousness.

        The presumption with these paleo diet books is that we evolved from apes… But truly evolved people choose vegan.

        The Gerson therapy cures cancer, going vegan is the essential first step to reversing cancer and heart disease.

      4. Paleo is the caveman diet; for people with caveman consciousness. The presumption with these paleo diet books is that we evolved from apes… But truly evolved people choose vegan.

        This article shows that your statement is simply false. Masters, the most highly evolved, or awakened, do not choose or teach, veganism. The presumption of paleo isn’t that we evolved from apes, although clearly we, and other primates have a common ancestor. The idea of paleo is that our stable, pre-industrial, pre-agricultural diet, the diet where we ate directly from nature, defines our natural diet, the diet that our biology is highly adapted to. That idea not only makes total sense, but in practice works to create and restore health.

        The Gerson therapy cures cancer, going vegan is the essential first step to reversing cancer and heart disease.

        Gerson therapy does indeed have good success with cancer but we need to be careful with cause and effect. Gerson therapy removes unnatural foods, grains and dairy from the diet, as well as many other interventions. Consider that hunter-gatherers do not get cancer or heart disease despite high intakes of animal foods. There is a big difference between a program to reverse cancer and one that will sustain the health of people over generations. And while the Ornish lifestyle program was successful in reversing atherosclerosis, more recent studies have produced the same effect even with Atkins style diets, i.e. it was weight loss in general, the process of weight loss that was largely responsible for the effect.

      5. so if meat eating is the natural for humans, why do you cook it? why do you use salt and spices? eat it as other animals do. eat raw unspiced meat. just think what food you would eat without cooking or spicing? FRUITS, VEGETABLES, NUTS, SEEDS!

  18. I think the basic presupposition that Eckhart Tolle is fully enlightened, and therefore we should follow his example and teachings, needs a lot more examination. Tolle is just one of countless people throughout history to have claimed to have achieved enlightenment, and to know the truth, and give us commoners a teaching we should follow. The fact that he claims he has achieved enlightenment makes me doubt him, even though I do love a lot of his teachings. I would not make my decision on whether to kill a living animal and eat it’s flesh based on what Eckhart Tolle does or says.

    1. If Eckhart, and the other big hitters say drop your egoic ideas and listen to your intuition, your Being, then perhaps it’s worth pondering that our fixed ideas may not be aligned with our deeper knowing. Ultimately, it’s about alignment, which is Oneness with Being, or alignment with Source, being Whole, and then see what you do! And that is a moment by moment thing — “I make no claims of consistency.”

      1. Joel Fuhrman’s books are vegan without being ideologically based, they are scientifically based. Both Fuhrman and Gary Null have helped people reverse cancer, heart disease and auto immune diseases with a healthy vegan diet. “if a food does not contain phytonutrients then it should be considered empty calories.” Dr. Joel Fuhrman. Animal products are empty calories.

      2. Well “phyto” means plant so by that definition animal foods would be empty. I find the definition ludicrous since animal foods are excellent, easily available source of many nutrients hard to find in plants. People generally will not eat a lot of vegetables, they HATE them, especially kids! Adults will only eat broccoli because they know it’s “good for them.” Why is that I wonder? Why are these foods that are supposedly so good so distasteful except in small amounts? One good reason could be because they have little or no calories, and so from a survival viewpoint, they are not good choices. However…. fruits, roots and tubers, squashes and other calorie-rich plants sources like pith, animals, fish, shellfish and other seafood, nuts and seeds, these are all worth eating. Funny how the foods we evolved eating gives us all the nutrition we need. I can tell you with NO DOUBT whatsoever, that everyone I know, including me, would never eat Fuhrman’s diet, ever. I can eat about 10 oz a day of vegetables, MAX, and even that is a struggle.

        Hunter-gatherers are well known for not suffering the diseases of civilization, including cancer, heart-disease and diabetes we don’t need to look beyond nature for what is healthy for our species. In fact, there was a study where they put diabetic aborigines back on the land hunting and gathering, guess what happened.

  19. Last thing from one spiritual seeker to another, read the World Peace Diet by Will Tuttle, it is the only other book I have found that is written at the level of intelligence and wisdom as Eckhart’s writings. Will has a phd and she also lived as a Buddhist monk when he was younger. Read the reviews on Amazon everyone says it’s amazing. He is as enlightened as Eckhart Tolle.

  20. People who live in 3rd world countries or in arid or cold climates, and in cultures that have to produce their own food may not be able to be vegetarian. We have supermarkets, they don’t. Eating meat is practicing this connectedness and “might makes right”

    1. Typo ^^ Eating meat is practicing disconnectedness and “might makes right” GO VEGAN, we have abundant choices, we have supermarkets

  21. Just imagine that you are the cow or chicken which is going to be cut with a knife in a few seconds from now….your neck will be severed slowly and blood will start oozing out….you will be panic stricken and scream with pain…and die slowly…then your skin will be removed and the flesh eaten..cooked in oil…

    put yourself in the place of cow or chicken….can you see?

    The knowledge is lacking in you….let me give a straight answer…

    There are stages of consciousness….least or absent in stones, rocks…..slightly more in plants, trees….more in birds, animals…..more in humans…..further more in spiritual beings….more in self realized…

    Stones, rocks you cant eat…mud you cant eat….so of the lowest plants…you eat the “fruits”….potato, tomato…are “fruits”….the whole plant is not killed…

    Hope this helps…

    1. Yes Jim, I used to think like that for decades. Now, not so much, even though I feel since then I have had a massive expansion of the heart. We assume that we are above plants and they have a lesser consciousness just because we have more of a capacity for judging, panicking and living outside the moment. I’m no longer sure we do… We also assume that there is something “wrong” with discomfort, fear and death, which is part of nature, and in our own lives often leads to our greatest expansions. Just ask yourself this… Are you ABSOLUTELY sure that the universe functions just like you think it does? I used think I was sure, but the more I learn and the more I surrender to “what is”, the less I realise that the totality of consciousness, when channeled through our limited brains, has any remote hope of understanding the complexities of the universe. I also enjoy my food more, which is no longer vegetarian and therefore far healthier and more delicious.

      1. Dear Phil,
        Due to many factors, consciousness does regress….there is no doubt in this…
        If you regressed from “veg to non-veg” and now enjoy delicious food…it is ok..
        still the reality doesnt changes

        in various lifetimes, beings go up and down the ladder…

        billions of things can happen…

        and the above are not “thoughts”…it is the Truth shared…you can take it or leave it for others to take..

      2. Oh dear… when we think we have THE truth we should listen to the alarm bells ringing. Vegetarianism just comes from a Hindu meme. There are no other cultures that have widespread vegetarianism that relates to their spirituality. The west was caught in the “guru” invasion in the 60s that brought with it vegetarianism, so we re brainwashed in that direction to the detriment of our genetic heritage and health… but meanwhile many cultures all over the world happily ate wild-caught animals and had their fair share of enlightened masters. (Please note I am not talking about factory farming here… I’m sure we are all agreed that is unnecessary). It is very naive to assume that all enlightened people are veggie and very disrespectful of many cultures to suggest that vegetarianism is a prerequisite of higher states. As for me personally, if I had stayed veggie I would be still fat and in pain with many autoimmune conditions including crippling inflammatory arthritis. I guess I was so stuck in my views it took that much pain to change them… and no, it has not been a regression in consciousness… quite the opposite. Maybe this recent post of mine might be of interest… My own story is in the comments below… http://pureactivity.net/misconceptions-enlightenment-waking/

  22. Dear Phil,
    It is Truth…which doesnt requires any support….dont be mistaken that it is my truth…it is universal

    Killing beings for your food and relishing the deliciousness…just for pleasure …when other foods are available….when you are not in ignorance (as you have searched for “enlightenment”)….is clearly selfishness and of the ego

    Also how meat helped your arthritis….i have no idea…..instead any type of meat is contraindicated

    1. Meat helps arthritis? hahaha now I have heard it all….. I have been vegan for 12 years now and can tell you from actual long term experience here I have NEVER ran into a single problem. I have not had a single flu, cold or any health issues for more than 10 years now. I originally went vegan because a friend said it would help me with my diabetes and other problems I was having. I did the raw organic vegan diet for 3 months and it didn’t just help it, it cured it haha. I have now cured 4 people of cancer through a raw organic vegan diet, accompanied by exercise and certain spiritual practices, one of these people being my father.

      People need to understand that Doctors have next to no nutritional training. The big pharmas don’t want you to be healthy or curing your self through diet and exercise, they need to keep you sick and fill your head with bullshit so they can keep the $$$ rolling in. The global market for pharmaceuticals topped $1 trillion in sales this year and yet cancer and other chronic degenerative diseases are still on the rise. But when I advertise free cancer treatment with a 100% success rate, I get calls from blocked numbers threatening my life if don’t stop…humans are pure herbivores, flat teeth, long intestinal track, stomach acidy (matches that of a herbivore whereas carnivores have 20x the acidity), alkaline saliva, no claws or long sharp teeth, carnivores don’t need fibre, when you see a dead animal with its innards hanging out it repulses you, the smell of blood doesn’t make you go crazy and want to eat or fight, you see animals being mistreated or abused it upsets you or maybe the fact that the average human being cant even catch a chicken with it’s bare hands… I could go on forever with this shit, I mean come on…. Stop listening to these greedy power hungry morons, switch off the TV do your own research, think logically, get out more and eat healthier, your body is capable of healing itself in everyway, it just needs the right fuel.

      1. Hi Bob… I never said meat cures arthritis, and you are right, it doesn’t – in fact too much protein can also cause trouble. However, good meat and fish in moderation are not the baddies they are made out to be, either in disease creation or in limiting higher states of consciousness. The main thing that initially tends to improve people when changing diets is the subtraction of sugars, grains, nightshades and dairy rather than the addition of anything. I applaud you for your cures for cancer, and totally agree that the real cause is in the emotions and the “spiritual” realms. Now, I am not such an expert on cancer cures – my speciality is in inflammatory/autoimmune conditions, and when trying to cure them, at least the physical aspect, it is safer to go the high fat low carb route as it rebuilds the gut flora. I did try the raw vegan route and stayed in pain, but I have seen that it has better success with cancer. Long-term though, maybe even in 40 years or so, nutritional deficiencies will show up, but you can be pretty healthy in the meantime if grains are minimised.

        I feel your zeal… I also wrote all that about flat teeth and gut length in my first book on diet and I cringe with embarrassment now. There is so much more to it. But to get back on topic – there have been many, many millions probably of awakened beings who have eaten meat. It is not a problem.

      2. Phil,

        We need neons around this: “The main thing that initially tends to improve people when changing diets is the subtraction of sugars, grains, nightshades and dairy rather than the addition of anything.” So much confusion out there about what to eat.

        You mentioned to me in an email about how Aborigines had that intimate connection with wild animals that I’ve experienced even though they hunted. Do you have any more on this?

      3. Great vid/audio thingy! Loved it!! Sorry Mike, I have no specific info about the Aborigines, but I seem to remember reading about many cultures’ healthy attitude to animals and eating them – killing happy wild animals with gratitude and taking no more than they need. It’s a different story down at McDonald’s, but at the risk of a spanking, I’m fairly sure that McDonald’s is also part of God, “He” being all nice and omnipresent and all . :)

      4. Hey, Phil, yeah the video is incredible eh? I’ve struggled with the paradox of the compassionate hunter for so long, and the vid is another big piece of relief for me, I really loved it, so clear… it’s our separation perspective that causes problems, and when we feel BAD, that is a clear sign we are separated. So clarity is moving swiftly in the issue for me.

        Yeah, it’s ALL GOOD as they say, I think we just need to focus on what we want to include and leave everything else out of it. Making a better world and focusing only on what YOU prefer, are the same thing.

        If you do come across info about the thing I mentioned, be sure to point me to it.

        Ciao!

  23. Esther Hicks is promoting that people be disconnected from their actions and willful ignorance. All animals fear death and will try to avoid harm. All male pigs are castrated without anesthesia, and in the US many pigs are kept in gestation crates, cages so small they can’t even move.
    What could be worse than to kill a sentient being that desires to live, just because you desire the taste of its flesh? And how about the mental impact of slaughterhouse workers who have to cut the throats of animals, 300 times an hour, day after day. This video shows that even channeled guides speak from their own limited perspective. 40% of Americans die from heart disease because eating meat is heartless.

    1. I dunno… I was a pretty angry vegetarian… Now I’m a very chilled carnivore. Life is so much easier without autoimmune conditions! Meat never caused heart disease – it’s the inflammatory sugars and grains that knackers the arteries. I think almost everyone is agreed on this now. Hunter gatherer tribes have little or no heart disease, and all eat meat. If it was the meat they would have heart disease. Don’t believe the hype. :)

      1. If someone has clogged arteries it is because they are eating animal fat and cholesterol, there is nothing in plant foods that will clog your arteries. The food writer Michael Pollan talks animals are fed grains like corn which contains very little Omega-3. 50 years ago when animals used to eat grass their meat and dairy contained 1/3 Omega-3 in the fat. All green plants contain small amounts of fat in the correct ratio. There is a difference between surviving and thriving, Inuits can survive on a high fat diet but they have the highest rates of osteoporosis.
        Dr. Joel Fuhrman helped his patients reverse auto-immune disease in his book Super Immunity with a phytonutrient rich vegan diet, by eating lots of greens, berries and beans.

      2. Now come on Joe… It has now been conclusively proved that dietary cholesterol cannot be translated into cholesterol in the arteries. Even the conventional chaps are onto that now. Look it up. Have you ever reversed an autoimmune disease? I have. Maybe some do on plant food, but I couldn’t, and I did try. I had to eat a high fat diet, mainly animal fats and coconut oil and cut out the sugars, carbs, grains etc. My inflammation levels dropped drastically and I lost over 80lbs with no calorie restriction. In the process I cleared out my arteries – I have seen this on scans – I am not guessing. High cholesterol is caused by inflammation from inflammatory foods and good clean meat and healthy fats are not inflammatory. Really, you are way behind on this. If you want to be veggie, go for it! It’s your choice and good luck to you, but trying to claim eating meat and fat is unhealthy is just misinformed. If you doubt my progress, have a look at the before and after pics on my website at http://pureactivity.net

        And to keep it on topic, I have never had such deep, stable “spiritual” experiences and my emotions and moods are balanced beautifully. This is very common when you no longer run predominantly on sugars which bring highs and lows all day.

  24. I have seen how animals who are being led into slaughterhouses where other animals have died in fear react the same way, as they sense that energy and emit pheromones of fear themselves. It’s all energy. I gave up eating meat from slaughtered animals years ago, because when I ate that meat, I was also consuming fear. I choose to do all that I can personally to be surrounded by and encapsulated by love rather than fear. -Wayne Dyer (I Can See Clearly Now)

    “Every day forty thousand children die in the world for lack of food. We who overeat in the West, who are feeding grains to animals to make meat, are eating the flesh of these children.”
    — Thich Nhat Hanh

    “When we eat an egg or a chicken, we know that the egg or chicken can also contain a lot of anger. We are eating anger, and therefore we express anger. So be aware. Be careful what you eat. If you eat anger, you will become and express anger. If you eat despair, you will express despair. If you eat frustration, you will express frustration.” -Thich Nhat Hanh

    1. I notice he conveniently didn’t add Thich Nhat Hanh’s opinion into the article, even though he’s a reputable Vietnamese Buddhist teacher. Thich teaches COMPASSION, which I believe is a vital issue to address, but his words don’t support the agenda of the article: Eat whatever your unconscious urges tell you to eat.

      I believe spirituality entails more than just being present. A person can come murder you in cold blood, while being present. Was it compassionate? No. You wanted to live.

      I’m not saying 100% compassion is possible in nature, but we as humans have the right to choose, and as enlightened individuals, we can understand even more deeply the implications of the choices we make.

      Our “being” craving roast chicken doesn’t account for what goes into the killing of that animal. It may be in our primal nature, but not in our evolved, conscious nature. We can more deeply understand the implications of our actions as spiritually-evolved beings, and we can make choices that are best for all beings on earth and the whole planet.

      Do the least harm and the greatest good.

      Plants can provide all of the nutrients necessary for human health. It may take special attention to incorporate the required balance of foods, but such is the case with any diet. There are methods to get certain foods into your diet that you might otherwise overlook. For example, superfood smoothies.

      The fact that not everyone wouldn’t follow a healthy vegan diet is irrelevant. If a monk can practice mindful and compassionate listening, and he can meticulously rake the sand in the garden, then he can take the steps necessary to eat the diet that will nourish his body and is most compassionate to other life and the planet as a whole.

      Like I said, do the least harm and the greatest good.

      Of course we will be killing plants. Of course life will be eating life, but would be far more efficient for all humankind to eat plants than it is to feed the plants to animals and eat them. Incredible amounts of land would be saved from destruction, and there’s not enough land on earth to feed 7 billion people out of natural ecosystems. Eventually the collective human consciousness, the actions of which are being influenced by a selfish ruling class, is going to destroy the earth and its very existence. Until then, more Veganism equals more time.

      And I will tell you something about Eckhart Tolle. He may be the “real deal,” but like many of the “gurus,” his teachings are not entirely practical. He’s endorsed by Oprah, one of the top elitist scum who is part of the ruling class I mentioned, and his teachings, although fundamentally correct on some levels, are being shared to the masses, but in a way that conveniently supports the unconscious and destructive globalist agenda; without directed action, his teachings can imply passivity over conscious resistance and willful ignorance of the repercussions of our actions.

      I, like other commenters here, appreciate his teachings, but I do not feel he is so infallible that he can short-sidedly determine the future of our planet. All “gurus” have unconsciousness within them, too.

  25. Added Adyashanti’s perspective to the article:

    Safransky: Could killing animals to eat them come from wholeness?

    Adyashanti: Sure. Life is killing. If we eat a vegetable, we’ve killed it. If we eat an animal, we’ve killed it. To be a living organism is to kill. There is no life without death. When we die, we’re going to be nutrients for something else.

    I don’t see life as “anything goes,” but I have seen wholeness move through different people in different ways. That’s why I’m always talking about action that comes from wholeness, not from division, nor rejection, nor grasping, nor pushing away. What motivates us when we’re not pushing or grasping, not relying on conditioned concepts of right and wrong, good and bad? Is there something else that can move us? And what is that? Action that is an expression of a clear and undivided state of consciousness is what the Buddha meant by “right action.” To exercise right action we must be functioning from a place outside of all egoic self-interest. We must be awake within the dream and be able to express that perspective.

  26. If killing animals is the same as killing plants, then go work one day picking vegetables and one day in a slaughter house. Killing animals requires hardening your heart.

    1. Imagine you’re a hunter on the Serengeti, need to feed your family. The herd of wildebeest is one million animals. Now how do you feel? We must separate the issue of killing animals for food, from the practices of the industry, and focus effort where it needs to be focused. Vegan diets aren’t working, the dairy industry is more cruel than the meat industry I am told by vegans, and the mass of land on Earth is suited to grazing, not growing vegetables. We need to have a bigger picture of nature and how we fit, we need to create edible ecosystems where life can flourish as well as provide… that is not the vision of large scale agriculture, when vast areas that could support abundant life are destroyed to plant grains, when any life that enters whether insect or weed is killed by chemicals which pollute. We need to maintain and sustain ecosystems. Zoom out and see the big picture. Have a vision, a holistic vision that works, and then perhaps you’ll see a better way. Veganism isn’t it. I don’t like the way the meat industry is, and the roots of cruelty are economic. Consumers go for low price which leads to abuse of people and animals. Neither do I like forests killed for grain, or palm oil, or small mammals and nesting birds chewed up by combine-harvesters, or chemicals killing insects. It’s all very short-sighted. Take a good look at permaculture, which addresses every issue of how we live and interact with nature in a way that does feel good. Have a look at the video on this page: http://permaculturenews.org/2012/06/01/zaytuna-farm-video-tour-apr-may-2012-ten-years-of-revolutionary-design/

  27. You forgot one very important ancient knowledge “AHIMSA”- It means that do not hurt any life forms. To kill an animal is not the same than to kill a vegetables. Its totally different. And we do not know exactly what does it mean “Jesus feed the people with fish”. Its in the Bible also, what is the food for us ORIGINALLY. Then we should follow God’s words, to go back to the Golden Age. In this world is not easy to be different, that is a fact.

    1. I think the principle of ahimsa is very much misunderstood and misinterpreted. In the Lord’s prayer, Jesus bids us to allow “thy will be done” and I believe ahimsa is along these lines. To me it means do not force, cling or manipulate, but rather allow God’s will on Earth as it is in Heaven, Allow divinity, life to flow. The creative power is not with the physical mind but the higher mind which is unconscious to the physical. Hence “do not force” the physical mind to do what it cannot do. This principle is difficult to live by, it takes moving into faith, and that is very different to how 99.9% of people believe life works, So ahimsa means do not straight-jacket your creativity by using force of the physical mind, but allow the true creativity to flow. One cannot second-guess God, but we can align with the divine. The physical mind cannot even string a sentence together, and if we observe the physical mind’s process, we can see this very clearly: the physical mind simply receives and perceives the result of the creativity that happened unconsciously.

      In the Bhagavad Gita, Krishna urges Arjuna to go into battle, and tells him that everyone on this battlefield will be killed, every one of his friends and family. Quite a stressful moment for Arjuna who is beside himself with panic at what is unfolding. But Krishna does not say “do not kill” he says relax, it is already done, don’t split from life. It is separation that causes fear. Very difficult to really know and live it, but all spiritual teachings are ultimately about aligning with and trusting the unconscious creative life force.

      1. Ahymsa translates as non-harmfulness. All sentient beings value their own life and want to avoid harm. Ahymsa means having compassion for all sentient beings.

        And Lierre Keith was NOT a vegan, she is just a shill for the meat industry. I can post a video of a radio interview she did where she says she was a vegan but she says “I binged on eggs and dairy whenever I had the chance.”

      2. What about the harm to yourself from eating a vegan diet? LK a “shill for the meat industry”? I find that statement absurd. She binged because her 99.9% vegan diet was lacking nutrition. That is her point. Have you read her book?

      3. A healthy plant based diet is the healthiest diet. Dr. T. Colin Campbell, Dr. Joel Fuhrman, Dr. Neil Barnard, Dr. John McDougall all have several best selling books based on science about plant based diets. Their books are based on science not on vegan ideology.

        Lierre Keith says that agriculture is destroying the planet…. Yes, ANIMAL agriculture is destroying the planet. Watch Cowspiracy

      4. I have not read Lierre’s book yet but I have listened to her on youtube. She says an acre of grass can feed as many cows as an acre of corn. Both feed 2 cows she says… That is like saying a pound of broccoli has the same amount of calories as a pound of corn flakes… Also cows cannot be grazed sustainably, wild animals eat small amounts of grass and move on, they don’t destroy the environment. But grazing cows will eat EVERYTHING, which also destroys habitat and diversity of natural species. Tax payers have to pay to re-seed the grass in public lands which cows are allowed to graze. This is an additional subsidy. They say that over 90% of the forests are gone. This is largely due to clearing land for animal production.

  28. Everything eats everything – the animals reflect the consciousness of humans back to them. Our world is a direct reflection of the density of our consciousness. Choosing to not cause harm and suffering to other sentient life forms (including plants) is part of the evolution of our consciousness towards greater harmony, peace and deeper compassion in our relationships with ourselves and all life. Take the DNA upgrade. You cannot be compassionate towards other life forms and then consciously cause suffering and harm at the same time, opposing energies. You are either harming or you are not. And the way I feel is that the path of least harm done, the lighter we live, the more our world will reflect that back to us because we are raising our vibrational frequencies in alignment with harmony and compassion and freeing ourselves from the denser planes of existence where suffering and separation exists. Our physiology is almost exactly the same as a frugivore. Plant-based, fruits, vegetables, nuts, seeds. Google images ‘carnivore omnivore teeth comparison chart’..

  29. Sigh, all the great teachers are teaching that it is our opinions and views of right and wrong that take us away from peace. The ego wants right or wrong, but there is no such thing. Things are as they are. Life is a paradox, the answer is always both. Example creation versus evolution? Both, the creation is evolving. As for meat, for some it is healthy and for other not… what is more dangerous that killing an animal for it’s meat is to have such a strong opinion about things that are understood only at a mental level. How can you say anything about veganism if you have never tried it? The whole hour eyes is about defying mental constructs and honoring intuition. This means that a heavy meat eater with ideas about ‘red flag’ vegan diet will naturally be drawn to have faith in something that doesn’t make sense to his mind. Equally, a vegan for 20 years, who has probably build ego identification with her diet, will be called to eat meat to defy her mental concepts.
    There is no right or wrong.. everything is set up in order to help us go beyond the mind and align with the heart. None of it is even real. So serious about such silliness. Just eat what your body wants and let others do the same. It is that simple. And enjoy what error food choice you are guided too, you’re allowed this too.

    1. Totally agree with your general sentiment, that it is concepts that block our inner guidance, although cause and effect apply. For example if someone does not have adequate B12, or choline, or retinol, or long-chain omega-3, then consequences will happen, sometimes irreversible. This happens despite the strongest belief in an inadequate diet. That’s why we will be guided to animal foods if we do not resist via concepts. One of the main pillars of veganism is the concept that meat eating is not sustainable, not kind to the Earth, wasteful, through the writing of people like John Robbins, but these ideas are a house of cards. So people cling to these concepts believing they are doing the right thing, are more evolved etc, but no, the inner wisdom has the whole picture.

  30. Was vegetarian with my first child…to weak to contract…had to have emergency c- section. Was meat eater with my second child and gave birth at home. Which birth was more spiritual? Genetics program the physical body…they don’t determine the spirit that resides in them.

  31. Are you able to watch a cow in the eys, and then kill her? if you can, you have the right to eat meat, if you cannot, like 90% of people, that’s mean you want to eat meat without the bad part. You want someone else do the dirty job cause it would deeply disturbing for you. It’s normal, you know it’s not fair, deep in your soul. But buying at supermarket it’s so easy!
    Eating animal is not a need, is just a desire. Fulfilling a desire basing on pain, is not acceptable.

    1. I agree with you Aldo. I find the article above nothing but justification for animal abuse and violence. Any truly spiritual being, with heart chakra intact, could not possibly condone the atrocities that are inflicted on animals in factory farms. I used to have great respect for Tolle, but he needs to wake up to this issue.

    1. so you say if I grab you on the street and beat you,rape you,kill you is bad,but if I first invite you to my home, cook a nice dinner for you ,put a nice music on, then I say I love you, I kiss you and then I cut your throat is ok?

  32. I did not read all the comments but wanted to chime in that I am 58, committed vegan for 20 years, same weight for past 30 years (123 lbs , 5’4″ female), no medications, no health issues, active mountain lifestyle (hiking, skiing, kayaking, etc…). I have a network of longtime vegan friends, all in their 50s and 60s in excellent health. So, again, if one can be healthy and happy without harming others, why wouldn’t one do that?

    1. I would agree. The question is whether a vegan diet is healthy for everyone. For example, some people are poor converters of plant forms of vitamin A into retinol, ALA is poorly converted to DHA, etc. Maybe it depends on ancestry/genetics. A lot of vegan problems may be B12 which has many spin-off effects, high homocysteine, myelin sheath problems and so on. Vitamin D status I think could also be a big issue. I definitely agree with your general statement though, if we CAN be happy and healthy without harming others, I would choose that. The spiritual masters all seem to advise eating what the body calls for, that there is wisdom is feeling for what you need in the moment, rather than having a preset philosophy. Pregnant women seem to often experience very strong callings to all sorts of strange foods that I imagine is the result of the body’s wisdom to make a healthy baby. For me, it has to start with belief, I struggle with the idea that a vegan diet could work for everyone. I would feel happier about it if there was an affordable way to do nutrient testing periodically to put my mind at rest that I was getting everything I need.

      1. After 18 years vegan, I had my B12, D and calcium levels tested. Normal, normal, and normal. And I am blood type O — the type is that is supposed to eat meat. According to medical professionals and nutrition researchers, plant based diets are healthier (Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn, Dr. John McDougall, Dr. Joel Fuhrman, T. Colin Campbell, Ph.D., and more than I can list here). The major killers in the developed world are diseases of excess, not diseases of deficiency. As for spiritual masters, here’s a response to that: http://www.ecorazzi.com/2016/05/30/spirituality-speciesism-and-the-ethical-symmetry-gap/

        I know that there are plenty of people who argue against veganism because they are unwilling to change, to be inconvenienced, to give up their comforts foods and addictions (cheese is literally an addictive substance similar to morphine). I can recognize them pretty quickly and don’t expend a lot of energy trying to convince them. Over and out.

      2. Hmmm the question is whether everyone can be healthy being vegan and your personal B12, D and calcium levels aren’t convincing :-) B12 will be fine if you supplement and most vegans do I imagine. Vitamin D will be fine if you get enough sunshine. Calcium wasn’t an issue.

        The docs you mentioned there are all in the same camp, no surprises. Fuhrman doesn’t recommend veganism. I could list hundred of low carb doctors for example, and this wouldn’t prove anything. Every diet out there has doctors supporting it as well as scientific evidence.

        Dietary excesses are problematic. So is deficiency. This is not a rational argument.

        There’s lots I can say about the article you linked to as the ethical rebuttal but this is only a blog comment. His main argument is that we stop our cars rather than run over dogs, deer or raccoons so therefore animals do matter. This is a palm slap to me because running a dog or deer over is not the same as eating animals for food. The former clearly has no reason, purpose or instinct. I believe that Adyashanti trusts wholeness because in our limited perspective we cannot know, cannot see all the causes and interactions. Is a vegan diet really least harm anyway… what of the billions of acres cleared to grow grains? What life was killed? What life is killed in the growing? What life cannot be because those acres are not left to nature? And what about people who live on land only suited to grazing?

        Is a dolphin evil because it eats fish? They co-evolved. Life exists as ecology and nature maintains perfect balance and health.

        I don’t fit into any of your four categories of people. I’ve actually been pondering this issue for decades.

    2. Me too.
      I am 52 and since 30 years vegetarian and vegan and never had any problems with health through my vegan life stile. I am feeling very young and everywhere I go people ask me how it comes that my skin looks so clear and smooth. I am working full time and the functioning of my body is simply perfect.

  33. If I ever decide to become a murderer of mankind for sport, I will echo Abraham’s lion contention to justify my vile deeds. Life eats life. If you accept her words as true, embrace the logical conclusion that no life is precious as one only destroys the forms at the end of the day, so get into that vortex and start indiscriminately killing any life that suits you. If you feel bad for killing other humans you’re making the mistake of taking life and all the forms in it far too personally. Thankfully, no one need kill humans anymore as processed foods and animal products serve as critical population control devices and anyone like abrahm is doing their duty to protect the planet by telling others to consume the poison for the good of the planet. These enlightened beings know more and understand more than the rest of us can comprehend or accept so be weary and abundantly cautious anytime you find yourself in a flock that follows enlightened beings. They are doing and saying what they must, it’s nothing personal.

  34. ………………which will suffer greatly on a vegan diet? You clearly are not aware of vegan athletes and harmful effects of eating meat – slow debilitating death by 101 illnesses caused by eating meat. The animals revenge,

  35. Good day .
    Jesus wasn’t vegetarian. How is possible thinking that? The rappresentation of Love that kill ad eat his minor brothers….
    The old and the new testament has been repeatedly manipolated during the time. The last one (officially) in the Council of Nicaea (325 d.c), where the world “food” in the new testament were replaced with the word “meat” for will of Costantin imperator. The “fish” mentionated in the gospels were seaweed pancake tipical of that time.

    Hiltler wasn’ vegetarian. It’s historic lie. He and his “propaganda” ministry Boogels professed himself as vegetarian for promote his imagen. His favourite dish was stuffed pigeons, as tell us his female cook in her book.

    And, For those who said the the vegan diet is insufficient, here there are the “damage” that ths diet can do :

  36. Being “enlightened” simply means you no longer listen to anyone else’s opinion or even your ego’s opinion, but you listen and follow your soul’s “opinion”. You listen and follow to your inner truth. That’s what being enlightened is. Simple.
    And that means getting out of ego conversations about eating meat/not eating meat, etc. Everyone’s entitled to their opinion. Listen to YOUR body and your intuition. FEEL what your body needs and give it to your body. That’s what means being aligned. It’s as simple as that.

  37. Really it’s pretty simple. If you have enough money to make choices about whether or not you will consume animal products, not consuming them is a far more logical choice. It is generally healthier, has FAR less of an impact on the environment and obviously is the more compassionate choice.

    Hunting or gathering your own animal products is another thing all together. Of course this is and has been a deeply spiritual part of life for many people’s accross the globe. Killing is not necessarily bad if it is done with respect and as a part of a sustainable ecosystem. Needlessly wasting the lives of animals can only come out of unconsciousness.

    If you want to consciously make a difference to your mind, body and world, not to mention the lives of billions of animals, go vegan. For me, being vegan is a choice of compassion. But I’m not so strict as to cause myself suffering. ✌🏼️

  38. It’s one thing to say glibly that “life eats life” and that to survive we must kill, even if ‘only’ vegetables but I don’t think any of these people would condone killing and eating other humans. When we are at a retreat or Satsang we can hopefully relax with the assumption that we will not become the next meal for the rest of the sangha. We are all part of the cycle of life and will all die but that is not a justification for murder. That we somehow think it’s acceptable to inflict violent death upon others simply because they are expressing and experiencing life through a body other than a human one isn’t a sign of liberation, it’s a sign of still being enslaved to our conditioned prejudice.

    1. Playing devil’s advocate I would say that not eating meat is conditioned prejudice, since humans living natural lives in the wild, unconditioned by thoughts, do eat a wide variety of plant and animal life. All animals in nature eat their natural diet, a dolphin is not evil for eating fish.

      It’s all one life, and there is no death.

  39. Hi Michael, I’ve read your post and I greatly admire the works of Eckhart Tolle & Adyashanti. However, there are so many flaws in the arguments presented here that I was compelled to speak.

    1) Lions don’t have a choice in the matter of food. They can only eat animals. On the other hand, we humans have a choice. Are lions evil for eating meat? No, because they don’t have a choice. Are humans conducting evil behavior when eating meat? Yes, because we do have a choice – we can choose to eat plants and not take the life of a being that clearly feels fear, pain and joy just like us.

    2) We don’t eat meat for survival – let’s be honest – we kill these animals for taste.

    3) Scientifically speaking, vegan diet is the healthiest. Meat and dairy are strongly linked (without any doubt) to diabetes, cancer, heart diseases, osteoporosis, arthritis and much more. This has been proven by tens of thousands of research studies.

    4) There is no “humane way” to kill an animal. The way to determine whether something is “humane” or not is to ask yourself if you would want the same thing done to you.

    5) What all these spiritual teachers (who I admire greatly for their work) have is called “Speciesism” – the belief that humans are superior to animals and can thus use them in any way we see fit. Humans and animals are different, but when it comes to feeling physical pain and fear, there is no difference between us.

    Introspect and you will find that the “circle of life” way of looking at things is an excuse to please our taste buds. Veganism is about minimizing pain and suffering of as many beings as possible.

    “Until one has loved an animal a part of one’s soul remains unawakened.” – Anatole France

  40. Dear Michael, here is the vegeterian myth book that you promote debunked. I also suggest that you read books such as “How not to die” by Michael Greger. “End of heart disease” By Joel Fuhrman. Enjoy the video debunking the vegeterian myth book.

    1. Hi Paul,

      Very interesting, yet people fail in droves on the vegan diet. Of course if you put up a video arguing one side it looks convincing because there is no counter argument. If you look at the people who promote vegan diets they do not look healthy in general. Like the PCRM, they are all skinny, not what you typically see in hunter-gatherers.

      Videos like this that give quick counter punch answers to cherry picked claims are disingenuous. You have to dig deep into every single argument and review counter-evidence etc. The whole thing is a giant puzzle but for me, until we know why people FAIL then it’s not viable. Many red flags. Even some vegan advocates acknowledge there are issues.

      I wish there were easy answers. I wanna be a Koala bear… where’s the eucalyptus leaves :-)

  41. Dear Michael,

    People fail in droves on non vegan diet and regain their health on a vegan diet and I see it all the time as a healer. Video arguing one side was just against the book arguing the other side. Peace and love.

  42. Most research today points to the benefits of plant-based eating. Eating animals and their secretions is ridiculous if you have the resources to eat a whole plant-based diet. The fact that some of these “gurus” eat is it because they apparently have not done much reading, or choose to eat what they like rather than what is ethical and humane.

Leave a comment

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s